Thusness, 2013:

"there is a very intense and much deeper state i assure u...but there is clear understanding that the manifestation is it....however awareness is like an unbounded and limitless expanse field

the luminosity is intensely clear

the experience is like Non-Dual Awareness broke lose and exist as a unbounded FIELD

there is a difference in seeing sound and a hearer and realizing sound as awareness itself

u cannot focus and there cannot be any sense of effort
there cannot be any sense of boundaries

just itself

u must be very very stable and mature in the anatta state

and u cannot be in an enclosed room...

it is the effortlessness and crystal clear transparency and intensity of luminosity...

but duality must no more trouble the practitioner, phenomena is clearly understood as the nothing is obscuring then in total effortless and emanation arises and the expanse just continues"

On how this differs from one mind:

"one mind is subsuming

therefore there is a sense of dual

in this case there isn't

it is like a drop of water landed on the surface of a clear ocean. the nature of water and ocean are one and the same...nothing containing anything

when sounds and music arise...they are like water and waves in ocean...everything is it"


Jackson Peterson wrote about Transparency, the experience and intensity of transparency is important (even though Jax is holding one mind view rather than anatta):


When sitting, fully relaxed, with no mental topics in mind;  consciousness will become ever more clear and sharp.

At some point the material substance of your head will seem to become clear and transparent, leaving no sense of boundary to awareness.

Suddenly a shift can happen, such that instead of feeling like a located physical entity, your cognitive nature becomes crystal clear, empty space: a space that co-exists with phenomena, but is timeless and changeless, pervasive presence.

It’s like being a material entity located within a physical body, in which that localized entity suddenly transforms into space.  It’s like consciousness as space had contracted into being a localized contraction of aware space, that suddenly reverted to its status as being empty, borderless space.

In Dzogchen, this is called “zangtal” or penetrating transparency.

In this moment it feels like you are the empty space of the universe instead of being a localized “thing” in the universe. All material identifications and psychological self images vanish.

Imagine there is an infinite ocean of transparent, Clear Light Awareness; which can contract into ice-cube like spheres of localized consciousness.  But that contracted consciousness of Clear Light Awareness can suddenly revert to its uncontracted state, its “natural state”. 

Only then do the intrinsic wisdoms of the Clear Light, Natural State, fully unfold. 


Daniel M. Ingram:

"So you have these two extremes - both of which I find pretty annoying (laughs) - and uhm, not that they are not making interesting points that counterbalance each other. And then, from an experiential point of view, the whole field seems to be happening on its own in a luminous way, the intelligence or awareness seems to be intrinsic in the phenomena, the phenomena do appear to be totally transient, totally ephemeral. So I would reject from an experiential point of view, something in the harshness of the dogma of the rigid no-selfists that can't recognise the intrinsic nature of awareness that is the field. If that makes sense. Cos they tend to feel there's something about that's sort of (cut off?)..."

Interviewer: "And not only awareness..."

Daniel: "Intelligence. Right, and I also reject from an experiential point of view the people who would make this permanent, something separate from, something different from just the manifestation itself. I don't like the permanence aspect because from a Buddhist technical point of view I do not find anything that stands up as permanent in experience. I find that quality always there *while there is experience.* Because it's something in the nature of experience. But it's not quite the same thing as permanence, if that makes sense. So while there is experience, there is experience. So that means there is awareness, from a certain point of view, manifestation - awareness being intrinsically the same thing, intrinsic to each other. So while there is experience, I would claim that element (awareness) is there - it has to be for there to be experience. And I would claim that the system seems to function very lawfully and it's very easy to feel that there's a sort of intelligence, ok, cool... ...the feeling of profundity, the feeling of miraculousness, the wondrous component. So as the Tibetans would say, amazing! It all happens by itself! So, there is intrinsically amazing about this. It's very refreshingly amazing that the thing happens, and that things cognize themselves or are aware where they are, manifestation is truly amazing and tuning into that amazingness has something valuable about it from a pragmatic point of view."


5/24/2012 8:05 PM: John: But experientially same but just the degree of right understanding
5/24/2012 8:07 PM: John: Not exactly one mind
5/24/2012 8:07 PM: John: Do u feel everything as Self now?
5/24/2012 8:08 PM: John: As in that experience of I M powerfully present at this moment
5/24/2012 8:09 PM: Soh Wei Yu: yes presence, but as change
5/24/2012 8:11 PM: John: As if like Awareness clear and open like space, without meditation yet powerfully present and non-dual
5/24/2012 8:12 PM: John: Where the 4 Aspects of I M r fully experienced in this moment
5/24/2012 8:14 PM: Soh Wei Yu: Yeah
5/24/2012 8:14 PM: Soh Wei Yu: I think the four aspects is only fully experienced after nondual and anatta, especially effortlessness and no need to abide
5/24/2012 8:15 PM: John: This experience will become more and more powerful later yet effortless and uncontrieved
5/24/2012 8:17 PM: John: How so? If it is not correct insights and practice, how is it possible for such complete and total experience of effortless and uncontrieved Presence be possible?
5/24/2012 8:18 PM: Soh Wei Yu: I do not see it is possible without the proper insights and practice
5/24/2012 8:20 PM: Soh Wei Yu: In anatta every activity is it, is buddha nature, so no contrivance at all
5/24/2012 8:21 PM: Soh Wei Yu: No need to meditate to get anywhere
5/24/2012 8:21 PM: Soh Wei Yu: But meditation is still important to cultivate certain aspects like tranquility
5/24/2012 8:22 PM: John: Indeed and this is being authenticated by the immediate moment of experience. How could there be doubt abt it. The last trace of Presence must be released with seeing through the emptiness nature of whatever arises.
5/24/2012 8:22 PM: Soh Wei Yu: I see..
5/24/2012 8:25 PM: John: After maturing and integrating ur insights into practice, there must be no effort and action.... The entire whole is doing the work and arises as this vivid moment of shimmering appearance, this has always been what we always called Presence.


Thusness, 2012:

"Has awareness stood out? There is no concentration needed. When six entries and exits are pure and primordial, the unconditioned stands shining, relaxed and uncontrived, luminous yet empty. The purpose of going through the 7 phases of perception shift is for this... Whatever arises is free and uncontrived, that is the supreme path. Whatever arises has never left their nirvanic state... ... your current mode of practice [after those experiential insights] should be as direct and uncontrived as possible. When you see nothing behind and magical appearances are too empty, awareness is naturally lucid and free. Views and all elaborations dissolved, mind-body forgotten... just unobstructed awareness. Awareness natural and uncontrived is supreme goal. Relax and do nothing, Open and boundless, Spontaneous and free, Whatever arises is fine and liberated, This is the supreme path. Top/bottom, inside/outside, Always without center and empty (2-fold emptiness), Then view is fully actualized and all experiences are great liberation."
5 Responses
  1. Anonymous Says:

    Got a Q abt birth by choice or karma : In wat situation/condition is rebirth by choice(soul chose certain parents , environment,disabilities etc...if born on earth...) and which situation the soul had no choice by simply being carried by force of karma into next incarnation? For U and Thusness, will the next birth by karma or by deliberation?

  2. Soh Says:

    According to scriptures, only 8th bhumi Bodhisattvas and above can decide rebirth, as they already freed from (uncontrolled) rebirth in samsara. All further births are not samsaric rebirth but 'emanations'.

  3. Anonymous Says:

    Hi Soh, given this bit is apparently from 2013, is Thusness pointing to an even further “stage” beyond #7 in his model? It seems to me that he’s pointing to a very deep, stabilized Anatta state–not implying a special way of perception but simply less “hindrances” that accompany the already-there lack of confusion.

    I suppose what I’m asking is that given the already-so lack of ignorance due to insights of anatta/emptiness, is Thusness saying that there is a further relative stage that compliments the existing clarity?

  4. Soh Says:

    It requires very stable anatta, possibly Stage 6 and 7 will stabilize the anatta.

    There are a lot of subtleties in 5, 6 and 7 that are not written. But it is not a separate category or realization, just a deepening of those.

  5. Anonymous Says:

    Ok, appreciate your response.